Williams Grove Speedway Forums

Does anyone know what Marks crew chief was complaining about? All I could hear was something about the checkered??

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2013 Totals

Lincoln:5
Grove:6
Port:5
Selinsgrove:1
Susky:2

I dont know but there was a really angry post about the grove on twitter

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2013 Race Counter:

Lincoln: 6
Williams Grove: 3
Susky: 2

They thought Brent had finished fifth in his heat. In fact, he was fifth at the flagstand to begin lap 10 but never completed lap 10, so he was a DNF in his heat.

Is it safe to assume that there was a really nice retraction posted after they learned the facts?

Ed

I read it and Am very disappointed especially if like you said they were in the wrong. I doubt any actions will take place but I'd like to see something happen. It's one thing to speak with an official about the situation but to make a scene like that was ridiculous. JMO don't wan to start a fight or people start bashing me

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2013 Totals

Lincoln:5
Grove:6
Port:5
Selinsgrove:1
Susky:2

In the case of a dispute between (anyone) vs. Williams Grove Officials, I would assume (anyone) is right roughly 99% of the time.

The situation had nothing to do with where Brent finished after breaking a rear end. The argument is the amount of time the team was given between heat and consi. They gave less than 10 min after the last heat. Yes, the team understands the threat of rain was the reason. They got the rear changed and had the car buttoned back up, only thing was to get wheels back in the car. They needed 2 more minutes but the track would not wait those 2 minutes. The point is this...everyone spends all this money to come race at Williams Grove. We spent $1000+ a night with everything included. We support the track every race they have and when the team needs 2 more minutes, their declined. Slap in the face. Our team is like a business too and the argument is we were not given the chance! Any other week they mess around for 30 minutes, whether it be fire works or whatever. But when it comes down to a situation the grove is not willing to work with the customer...if our situation was unfixable and we couldn't be done in a sufficient amount of time then that's on us. But we were...unfortunately we were declined an extra couple minutes on top of the 10 given to get wheels on the car. That's our argument so don't think we were starting a problem because of finishing position.

And, unsurprisingly, it looks like Williams Grove Officials are in the wrong again. Keep the streak of bad decisions alive! I love the track but something needs to be done about the constantly terrible decisions that officials are making there on a what is now a yearly basis.

S. Smith running out of gas but getting restart in same position
T. Shaffer getting to restart for "safety concern" and getting his spot back when he clearly only stopped for a clean restart
D. Dietrich not getting the proper amount of time to get back on the track
Race being called before Dewease crossed start-finish
Now this

Could probably come up with 10 ridiculous decisions in the past two or three seasons without much trouble.

There was a bunch more obviously, this is just what I remember right away over the past few seasons. On the other hand, I can't remember anything Lincoln did that would be comparable.

Again, facts from one of the track's officials who, despite 111's opinion, really cares about the teams that come to our track every week and respects the money car owners spend doing it.

I try to stay in the vicinity of cars being repaired with hopes of returning to the track in that event or the next one. The chief flagman also cares and had the tower wait to start the ten-minute clock until the 19m had been towed to its pit area, not when the heat race was checkered. That probably gave them an additional five minutes. I kept the team alerted to how much time remained and then how many laps were on the pace truck. The ten minutes were up before the truck completed the three laps, after which cars are no longer permitted to enter the track. But the flagman waited as long as he could, asking me for updates all the while. There is another minute or so. When the pace truck had completed its laps, I was asked if the 19m was ready by the track's general manager. It wasn't, every time allowance we could extend to the 19m had expired and weather was threatening, so we went racing.

So as you can see, the 19m actually did receive more than ten minutes - perhaps as many as seven extra minutes. That's a 70% over-allowance and the track's general manager was even involved. I fail to see how the track deserves to be criticized for its handling of the 19m's dilemma. Do we make mistakes? Sure and so does 111 and the officials at other tracks. 111 forgets or may not know that I used to work at Lincoln - I saw numerous faux pas at that track, too.

Ed

I love how you refer to my facts as "my opinion," but you also think randomly pulling numbers out of a hat (draw racing) is a good idea, so no point arguing with you. Referencing factual, defined mistakes as "opinion" says all it needs to about how you view officiating at the track. And please, name some recent instances in which Lincoln made any comparable mistakes to the several Williams Grove (you?) have. I can't think of any, maybe those "faux pas" only took place back when you were there (...).

Should of just given the two minutes.

GO BRENT !!! (the nickel guy)

Anyone ever been to an NHRA event? You are on the line or you load up. The problem with bending is then you have to bend for everyone and at some point will always be not enough.

I'll bet if it was a Rahmer or dewease or Hodnett they would of found a reason to delay a little longer, even with the chance of rain. seen it many times!

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http://www.ronaurand.com

I am a big BMR fan because the man has talent and does not b!tch and wine like some others so to not give him 2 extra minutes is a bad call seeing as the race got in before the rain. now that being said if the track would have given those 2 minutes and not got the race in due to rain then that would have been a horrible business decision. we base our decisions on what we feel is best and the grove made a decision as a business as to what they thought was the best choice. it is upsetting that Brent did not make the show but the grove has to be run like a business or it will not survive. just think about how many people would be on here complaining if Brent would have gotten those extra minutes and the race didn't get in. They say that hind sight is 20/20 and looking back I am sure Ed wishes that he would have gotten them as do I. This is my opnion and just that. BMR you guys go get a win to night and make all your fans proud. Brent you are a real class act and I wish you would have gotten those 2 minutes.

With all due respect to BMR, they needed significantly more than two (additional) extra minutes. When the starter finally announced the pits closed and that the race would go green the next time around, the 19m's rear was not even fastened in place. One crew member was positioning set-up blocks under the axles while others jockeyed the rear around, knocking the set-up blocks to the ground. I honestly believe that when the 19m crew looks back on the evening, they will see where the track afforded them every possible opportunity to get the repairs completed in time for the B - aside, of course, from those infamous two minutes that really wouldn't have mattered - and made sure they were kept aware of the time they had remaining instead of just "going green" without warning them repeatedly.

I like the Marks' team. They are a bunch of nice guys who, even in the heat of the moment last night, asked me about their heat race finishing position in a calm, gentlemanly manner - no yelling, name-calling or threatening. Brent is a classy young man who has always been polite to others and has a bright future in this sport. I was sad that they didn't make it out. They gave it a valiant, fairly organized effort but just came up short on time.

I have a question to ask 111, who appears to be wasting his evenings as a spectator when he knows my job and those of our other officials better than we do, about one of his "facts." Regarding Lincoln's miscues, how would a pit official like me be able to affect what happens - for better or worse - on the track? And another of your "facts" is incorrect, too. I do NOT like draw shows or depending upon luck for success; I only like them better than our current form of handicapping by a season-long point or dollar average. I DO think that handicapping on a moving five-week average minus the best and worst finish would provide the fairest method for both the teams and the fans.

My co-workers often ask me why I put up with abuse by participating on this board, as I am the only one who posts here. I believe that some fans enjoy knowing what really transpires "behind the scenes" but at times like this, I wonder why I bother too.

Ed